New member getting ready to swap the motor.

How to ruin the car !!
Fit any form of aftermarket Engine management ................
Screws up proper functioning of Transmission, Dash Cluster, ABS / ESP, Cruise / LIM.

Motor ECU has to speak the same language as all the rest of the Computers on the Powertrain CAN.
This means that realistically, the only Engine swap that can be made to work has to be a Mercedes Engine from the same era, and even then it's not as easy as some other MB Swaps.

R170 is unique electronically and wiring speaking as it uses Modules and components from different generations of Mercedes, with factory custom firmware / software and oddball wiring for some systems
So lets just say you had a 320 V6 W203 C Class and a 5.4 litre V8 W220 S Class, swap the Motor, Motor Harness and a few other bits, relatively easy, with SDS and KTag needed to virgin and initial start the motor ECU. Job done.

Now try the same M113 V8 swap on an R170 ...................

A world of pain that very few have achieved on their own, hell I'm considered an expert by some, and my core business is repairing MB's, but despite my conversion starting up first turn of the key, and driving with everything working, even I still needed some extremely specialised help on a issue with the Motor ECU Eeprom programming.

Upside is if you successfully do it you have an almost unique Car, I did, I do

If you are wanting to fit another Engine from a different manufacturer, such as any of the plethora of Chevy V8's, Lexus motor, or what ever, I've followed lots of these and they almost always end up scrapped, those that do drive certainly don't work that well as a road car, and definitely not "the goal" which should be that it should look feel and drive as if it came from the MB Factory just one helluva lot quicker, i.e. Supercar quick with handling and braking to match.

That said, don't let me put you off, but please post detailed reports of your project progress here in the R170 performance mods section for all to follow.

I'll leave you with this for a bit of an enthusiasm boost ....

BaD_81 said:

OP, you should search Dave2302 posts and read about endine ECU firmwares, updates etc.
Different engine in MB cars, with so complicated computer systems...I will just share opinion, if you ask the question, might be too big if a spoon for your mouth ( without trying to insult or laugh or...) People's problems around here are based on Factory fitted electronics being or getting stupid. Re-educating these electronics might be too complexed task for many.
Ant probably @Alex.M-oneeleven can share his battles with ECU and engines too.

Click to expand...

Dave2302 said:

How to ruin the car !!

Fit any form of aftermarket Engine management ................

Screws up proper functioning of Transmission, Dash Cluster, ABS / ESP, Cruise / LIM.

Motor ECU has to speak the same language as all the rest of the Computers on the Powertrain CAN.

R170 is unique electronically and wiring speaking as it uses Modules and components from different generations of Mercedes, with factory custom firmware / software
So lets just say you had a 320 V6 W203 C Class and a 5.4 litre V8 W220 S Class, swap the Motor, Motor Harness and a few other bits, relatively easy, with SDS and KTag needed to virgin and initial start the motor ECU. Job done.

Now try the same M113 V8 swap on an R170 ...................

A world of pain that very few have achieved on their own, hell I'm considered an expert by some, and my core business is repairing MB's, but despite my conversion starting up first turn of the key, and driving with everything working, even I still needed some extremely specialised help on a issue with the Motor ECU Eeprom programming.

Upside is if you successfully do it you have an almost unique Car, I did, I do

If you are wanting to fit another Engine from a different manufacturer, such as any of the plethora of Chevy V8's, Lexus motor, or what ever, I've floowed lots of these and they almost always end up scrapped, those that do drive certainly don't work that well as a road car, and definitely not "the goal" which should be that it should look feel and drive as if it came from the MB Factory just one helluva lot quicker, i.e. Supercar quick with handling and braking to match.

That said, don't let me put you off, but please post detailed reports of your project progress here in the R170 performance mods section for all to follow.

I'll leave you with this for a bit of an enthusiasm boost ....

View attachment 628573

View attachment 628574

Click to expand...

I guess that I was not clear enough. I am talking about replacing the engine and transmission with a turnkey stand alone independent engine and transmission system without integrating it with the existing ECU or trying to piggy back off of the Mercedes ECU or TCU.
What I am looking for is those items that may take data from the factory ECU to use as an input for a non-drivetrain system and how extensive it is.

For example, is there an ABS input coming directly from the ECU to the ABS computer for calculations to function properly? Or is the ABS system completely independent where the wheel sensor goes directly to the ABS computer? If the ABS system (and most other systems) run completely independent, then there is no issues with a swap.

I do understand that the standard tach, speedometer, cruise, etc. will need dealt with, but beyond that, what
other systems communicate with the drivetrain computers? This isn’t about retaining all the creature comforts as much as making a “kit car” type platform out of an SLK for this drivetrain. My original thought is to use a TVR 280i or a Conquest TSI/Starion ESI-r platform for this purpose but after comparing the Mercedes and donor motors side by side, they are very close to the same physical dimensions.

I feel kinda qualified to answer these kind of questions since I have built probably 20 + absolutely mental project vehicles (as well as several insanely powerful Powerboats, one of which had twin 500ci Big Blocks in it), over my 47 years in the Motor trade which also includes owning and driving various exotica too

zeWaardt said:

I feel like we’re acting like this car is some sort of magic box that is completely impossible to work on.

If all the sensors are the same and you have the proper tools to relearn, what’s the big deal?

Click to expand...

It is not impossible, no swaps are truly impossible, impractical maybe, i.e. John Dodd, an old Transmission Firm buddy of mine, he built a "Rolls Royce" with a V12 Merlin Engine and drove it on the UK (and abroad) roads. He got sued by Rolls Royce for using their Grille and Baging Impractical, yes, amazing feat of engineering ABSOLUTELY !!

V8's into R170 and Crossfires there are a fair few of us that have done it, fewer who have really got it 100% right, but it is beyond the realms of most DIY'ers and Hot Rodders to reverse engineer Mercedes programming code.

Sensors are not all the same, nor is some of the Hardware and SMD's within seemingly identical modules. Wiring circuitry is also different to the MB norm in certain critical areas, than on many other of it's same era Models, that is the failure points !!
Most who attempt these conversions do not have the correct (expensive) equipment , software and most importantly knowledge to be manipulating and re writing hex code to various Modules !!

Hence there are 100 times the number of abandoned R170 (non standard) Engine swaps, than there are successes.

Almost anyone can cobble together some often awful parts to bung a V8 or whatever into any Car, but the end result is usually something unreliable, not really daily drive-able and often downright dangerous

Several of my previous conversions have been extremely quick, but despite being road legal, they were not a pleasure to drive long term on the road ...................

2 that spring to mind ....

A fun build based on a good mates "that can't be done bet" for £5, and built mainly for a Street Legal Drag Race series !!
A 1972 Fiat 500, 400ci Small Block Chevy with Nitrous, 700R4 Trans, Space-frame, LSD etc etc yak yak yak ......................

Great fun good on the strip, but even a 20 mile road trip on a sunny day was more than enough, despite the fact that the fun there was in cruising along a motorway at 70mph watching for a BMW yak yak yak to come flying towards my rear end, only for me to floor the throttle and leave him in a cloud of smoke and following 2 big black rubber stripes along the carriageway

And then there was the 1999 1.7 litre front wheel drive Ford Puma, (based upon the Ford Fiesta monocoque), another "that can't be done" car primarily built for Special Stage Rallying on gravel forest tracks.
24 Valve Quad cammer 3.0 V6 Cosworth (formula 3000 Engine developed originally by Brian Hart, who sold out to Cosworth), mated to 5MT 4x4 Cosworth Sierra running gear, brakes, steering etc etc yak yak yak

Extensively modified floorpan and monocoque, wide arch Ford Racing Puma body kit, and full Stage Rally spec ................
Absolute beast in the forests and on tarmac, but rearranged your innards and spine plus deafened you when driving on the roads for much more than a 25 mile round trip !!

The Fiat 500 ....







The Ford Puma ....







On the other hand three of my previous monster engined Cars shown below were built purely for road use, very street-able, everything worked and interacted exactly as it should and 2 capable of sustained 170 mph +++ the Firebird was clocked at over 200 mph and ran high 9's / low 10's, even the Range Rover, which is as aerodynamic as a brick would get just over 150 mph with it's 6.5 litre Turbo Diesel Chevy V8 and 700R4 Chevy Blazer Transmission, that Range Rover was built to haul my Powerboats back in the day, and haul ass it did ....







Not forgetting the current supercar on my fleet which has hit 176 so far before my 'arris told me it was time to brake hard before I ran outta tarmac 🤣 ....



Hope y'all enjoyed

Only watch the 2nd thus far.

A grin car, a respectful vid.
Guy was pure genius.

Now, I may be showing ignorance, but if being used then I suspect power steering might be a pita. I’ve hit those wobble pot holes and stones that deflect steering and it’d be the last thing I’d want on an autobahn. As is would it not just sail thru such?
Sure, a 20 zone would be titanic but….

Now, just imagine if the British car industry had engaged with him….

5 x 5.4 = 27!

cold shower time.

The ideal engine swap would be to take the car to where Mercedes left off, or should have taken the platform. And as Dave has commented, it should have factory fit and finish, to be a reliable vehicle fit for trips or daily use. Like Jay Leno would do on a restomod for example.

I have lived with 5 R170 SLK's, over 11 years, and know them well.
There is a path to modern greatness for the SLK230 if someone with the resources wants to try.

Build an SLK45 AMG.

M139 416hp 4 cylinder AMG engine and trans from the A/GLA45.
Put the car on a diet, carve off a few hundred pounds with lightweight seats, carbon hood, trunk lid, etc. (R170 already lighter than newer SLK models)
Use the SLK32 AMG suspension parts, shocks, springs, sway bars. (AMG tuned, best compromise of ride and handling, why try to reinvent)
Carbon fiber chassis stiffening at strategic points.
Remove unsprung weight with forged aluminum or magnesium wheels (Augment in Canada will custom make any wheel for a price that isn't crazy) and lighter brake calipers on front .
Wavetrac diff.
Get all the creature comforts and instrumentation working like factory.
The result would be pure modern motoring joy in classic form.

Dave's interpretation of the SLK evolution is equally great in a different way, with period correct MB V8 and quality that looks like factory. Just, awesome.

There is a company in the US that puts E55 supercharged V8s (500+hp) into the SLK/crossfire chassis in a quality way, if the v8 path is your thing, use them or their template. Want to Wake Up a Sleepy Crossfire? Drop in a Supercharged AMG V8! (motortrend.com)

If you are going to do it, do it right,.
Happy top down spirited motoring.
R